Clojurians Log v2

@dustingetz I just want to ask some obvious questions to make sure i understand things. Is hyperfiddle a tool for development or something you could build into a product you expose to paying non dev customers

Or possible both

Both

jar file in your app is open source from github

the CLI that talks to arbitrary datomic database will eventually cost money

jar file and CLI are pretty much the same thing, just different types of user

I think your idea is somewhat distant from things i’m comfortable with, so i

…im going to need some time to process

err what does CLI stand for in this context?

command line interface

you could also think of CLI as “the app from the mac app store”

> jar file in your app is open source from github Is this eluding to the idea that we can use the information in a github repo to create the jar? Which is the direction some of the recent changes to clojure deps are going?

Yeah, its not documented yet but yeah

Thanks for answering questions. I’m excited about this but i’m still wrapping my head around it… > the CLI that talks to arbitrary datomic database will eventually cost money I dont follow. I think of a CLI as a program that you interact with at the terminal, if so, then i dont understand how that relates to costing money.

hyperfiddle is free and open source, you use it as a library embedded in your application, load it from maven coordinates, define a project.clj, with a build etc. But Hyperfiddle is also useful standalone datomic administration tool, think of it as kind of like like PGAdminIII or ToadForOracle.

or as MS Access

If that business model fails we also have the managed cloud hosting angle

Really we’re just throwing darts here. Nothing is set in stone. We’ll figure out a business model that works that also lets us build a developer ecosystem, and that requires it to be fully open source

I understand, your talking about the duality between what developers want and what customer want, which is access to data.

Let me ask another question just to orient myself. It seems like Hyperfiddle lets you build an app were someone can write queries against the database. Is that correct?

Yeah, subject to the security “vetting” that you outlined

When i theorized about letting customers/front end clients send sql more directly to the DB there were lots of valid concerns around security and performance. Is there some overlap in ideas here? Or i’m i missing something?

You understand it properly

this is awesome. I feel like i basically had this crazy idea and someone (you?) built it out the same day i started thinking about it.

We can “bake” the fiddles in the server, such that only a whitelist of queries are allowed, as you suggested

Performance was a nightmare. We’re landing a huge perf changeset this week ish

I dont mean crazy… sorry, i just mean, its unorthodox

Performance delayed our launch by six months

You’re good! What made you get the intuition about the impedance mismatch?

Probably working with a lisp at a early stage in my career and being relentless about things that are similar at some more primitive abstraction layer but have vastly different interfaces. Also i’m probably a bit worried about my productivity so i’m constantly questioning why I can’t get things done faster/better.

This slack community has been awesome with throwing out ideas too.

Yeah, Rich Hickey and the greater clojure community really outline deep answer as to why none of us can get anything done

Thanks for chatting. I hope ill have some time to play around with this more this weekend. I’ll have to get my hands dirty before i probably feel i really get it.

Cool, i dont know how successful you’ll be until our perf changeset lands. I might suggest you wait until we give the all-clear; you’ll hear about it here or on reddit

Thanks for saying hi!

> Cool, i dont know how successful you’ll be until our perf changeset lands. I wouldn’t be doing anything more then experimenting with the idea, will that really make a difference?

If you were trying to log into the tool and make something, that probably wont work

If you are doing thought work, I would be happy to discuss your ideas!